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Surrounds - Bipolar?
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Mani
Posted
9 years 3 months ago
Newbie here. Believe it or not, I started with a $500/pair budget for fronts and read myself into 5K range. I was almost ready to pull the trigger on DefTech BPs. But I was lead into GE T1s. Way out of my budget. T2s will still fit. That debate is on.
However, just to match timbre, is it necessary to buy speakers from same company (especially surrounds)?
Reason for my question is that if I buy T1/2 what surround speakers should I go for? Can I buy bipolar from another company? I read everywhere that bipolars are best for surrounds. Is the GE surrounds 'regular' speakers? If yes, how does that compare to bipolar speakers?
However, just to match timbre, is it necessary to buy speakers from same company (especially surrounds)?
Reason for my question is that if I buy T1/2 what surround speakers should I go for? Can I buy bipolar from another company? I read everywhere that bipolars are best for surrounds. Is the GE surrounds 'regular' speakers? If yes, how does that compare to bipolar speakers?
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Dark
Posted
9 years 3 months ago
I don't think it's necessary that the surrounds be timbre matched (although it IS ideal). I think your front sound stage MUST match so I hope you are considering a GoldenEar center channel.
As for the bi-pole style speaker, I think in the earlier days of surround sound technology bi-pole speakers DID offer a more immersive experience, but that's not the case anymore and here's why. In the early days of surround sound often times the surround speakers were 'matrixed' or basically digitally sound processed to fill those rear speakers. Here bi-pole/di-pole speakers helped spread this sound out more.
Nowdays surround sound is built using dedicated channels just as refined as left and right when stereo was introduced. As a result of these dedicated channels and the ubiquity of surround sound speaker systems for cinema and home, sound designers are more deliberate and indulgent in their use side/rear channels. They are more conscious of the directivity of the speaker they choose to play a sound from.
As an anecdote, I just watched Pirates of the Caribbean (released 2003) and you could definitely tell that the surround speakers where not used for deliberate sounds and were used more for affects of cannonballs, explosions, etc. In fact, I don't recall hearing a single important dialogue piece coming from any of these speakers. Contrast that with Captain America (released 2014), which I watched the previous night, and there were definite important audio ques being sent to those rear channels, discretely.
And as we move more and more towards object oriented sounds discretely placed all around us (ie, Dolby Atmos), this trend will only increase and not decrease, in my opinion.
As a result, I think we should design our audio systems to best support this sound design philosophy by using direct-radiating speakers.
As for the bi-pole style speaker, I think in the earlier days of surround sound technology bi-pole speakers DID offer a more immersive experience, but that's not the case anymore and here's why. In the early days of surround sound often times the surround speakers were 'matrixed' or basically digitally sound processed to fill those rear speakers. Here bi-pole/di-pole speakers helped spread this sound out more.
Nowdays surround sound is built using dedicated channels just as refined as left and right when stereo was introduced. As a result of these dedicated channels and the ubiquity of surround sound speaker systems for cinema and home, sound designers are more deliberate and indulgent in their use side/rear channels. They are more conscious of the directivity of the speaker they choose to play a sound from.
As an anecdote, I just watched Pirates of the Caribbean (released 2003) and you could definitely tell that the surround speakers where not used for deliberate sounds and were used more for affects of cannonballs, explosions, etc. In fact, I don't recall hearing a single important dialogue piece coming from any of these speakers. Contrast that with Captain America (released 2014), which I watched the previous night, and there were definite important audio ques being sent to those rear channels, discretely.
And as we move more and more towards object oriented sounds discretely placed all around us (ie, Dolby Atmos), this trend will only increase and not decrease, in my opinion.
As a result, I think we should design our audio systems to best support this sound design philosophy by using direct-radiating speakers.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Moderator, WayneWilmeth, rjohn79395, T Cobe, aribraun, filmfan214
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Mani
Posted
9 years 3 months ago
Thank you Dark. That's very useful. If I need engulfing room filling sound (not sure if I am using the right audio terminology here), if I choose to buy GE T1/SC combo for fronts, can I still get that out of GE's current offerings? Reason I am asking is that most of other speaker companies (Paradigm, Def Tech, RBH etc) are using bipolar design. Hence the hesitation.
If I buy regular radiating design, which direction should I place these? Sides? Back? Facing front? Towards listener?
If I buy regular radiating design, which direction should I place these? Sides? Back? Facing front? Towards listener?
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WayneWilmeth
Posted
9 years 3 months ago
Hi Mani, welcome to the forum!!!!! Great questions!!!
First, can I speak to the front L&R speakers question? You are looking at some of the BEST speakers that can be bought, IMHO, and especially at their prices!!!! I have the Triton 2s and love them. I have not heard the Triton Ones, but everyone who has says they are even better than my T2s. Did you have a chance to audition them yet? How did the Ones sound compared to the T2s to you???
I always say to get the best speakers you can afford because you will listen to the for years, perhaps the rest of your life. The little more you pay now will be forgotten but the pleasure of listening to them goes on years and years!!!!
You would love the T2s, but from all reports, the Ones will take you nearly to heaven. I would buy the Ones if I could.
Secondly, about surround speakers, GEt speakers are NOT bipolar, and that is by design. The idea that surrounds should be bipolar speakers is quite outdated. I am using the T 3s for surrounds and T 7s for rear surrounds along with a ForceField 5 sub. My center channel is SC X. So I am sure you have guessed that I believe, my experience is that all the speakers in the home theater should match, be from the same company and in our case, with GEt speakers, they will all have the same sound signature.
Fortunately for us with GEt, the whole range of speakers have the same HVFR and sound, and are VERY cost effective compared to other speakers of similar high performance sound.
I hope this helps, please keep in touch and enjoy your search.
Let us know what you decide and how it works out for you?
God Bless,
Wayne
First, can I speak to the front L&R speakers question? You are looking at some of the BEST speakers that can be bought, IMHO, and especially at their prices!!!! I have the Triton 2s and love them. I have not heard the Triton Ones, but everyone who has says they are even better than my T2s. Did you have a chance to audition them yet? How did the Ones sound compared to the T2s to you???
I always say to get the best speakers you can afford because you will listen to the for years, perhaps the rest of your life. The little more you pay now will be forgotten but the pleasure of listening to them goes on years and years!!!!
You would love the T2s, but from all reports, the Ones will take you nearly to heaven. I would buy the Ones if I could.
Secondly, about surround speakers, GEt speakers are NOT bipolar, and that is by design. The idea that surrounds should be bipolar speakers is quite outdated. I am using the T 3s for surrounds and T 7s for rear surrounds along with a ForceField 5 sub. My center channel is SC X. So I am sure you have guessed that I believe, my experience is that all the speakers in the home theater should match, be from the same company and in our case, with GEt speakers, they will all have the same sound signature.
Fortunately for us with GEt, the whole range of speakers have the same HVFR and sound, and are VERY cost effective compared to other speakers of similar high performance sound.
I hope this helps, please keep in touch and enjoy your search.
Let us know what you decide and how it works out for you?
God Bless,
Wayne
God bless the child that's got his own.
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Mani
Posted
9 years 3 months ago
Thanks Wayne. I have not auditioned the T1s. Will visit the dealers shortly. I am all but sold just on the reviews that I am seeing. Like you said, I am trying to avoid buyers remorse as the extra 500 will soon be forgotten.
For T2s, do you still need Subs? Or does that go away if I buy T1 (I am trying to convince me that I can re-redirect subs investment into T1s and justify the jump).
For T2s, do you still need Subs? Or does that go away if I buy T1 (I am trying to convince me that I can re-redirect subs investment into T1s and justify the jump).
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Dark
Posted
9 years 3 months ago
Hey Mani,
Dolby actually has some great guides for speaker placement based on the number of speakers you plan on using.
www.dolby.com/us/en/guide/speaker-setup/index.html
By using timber matched surround speakers you'll get the benefit of consistent, life-like sound as sounds pan around you. This is especially important if you do any gaming, like I do.
The added benefit of using GE speakers is their imaging, as I'm sure you've heard. Imaging being the ability to make you believe a sound is coming from between the speakers. What this means is you won't get the 'holes' in the sound field as sound moves around like you would from other direct-radiating speaker brands; which is what bi-pole speakers try to fill.
Also, take a look at GE's in-wall MPX speaker. I think it offers many of the benefits of bipole speakers.
Dolby actually has some great guides for speaker placement based on the number of speakers you plan on using.
www.dolby.com/us/en/guide/speaker-setup/index.html
By using timber matched surround speakers you'll get the benefit of consistent, life-like sound as sounds pan around you. This is especially important if you do any gaming, like I do.
The added benefit of using GE speakers is their imaging, as I'm sure you've heard. Imaging being the ability to make you believe a sound is coming from between the speakers. What this means is you won't get the 'holes' in the sound field as sound moves around like you would from other direct-radiating speaker brands; which is what bi-pole speakers try to fill.
Also, take a look at GE's in-wall MPX speaker. I think it offers many of the benefits of bipole speakers.
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